Accesso rapido:  

Forum: General Discussion

Topic: Breaking out the ol' sound system. Need help on setup recommendations - Page: 1

Questa parte dell'argomento è obsoleta e potrebbe contenere informazioni obsolete o errate

I had been retired from DJing for about 4 years now. I sold most of my stuff but now I have companies and people requesting still that I DJ and I could honestly use the extra money. Unfortunately, the only system pieces I have left to work with is:

- Samsung series 5 ultra laptop 8gb ram i5 processor
- Behringer Pro VMX 300USB mixer
- Samson Wireless Mics
- Peavey PV14 audio board
- Behringer ultra Curve Pro DSP 8024
- Peavey PV900 amp

I am looking for feedback on what I got left to make a system with for small parties consisting of 200 people outdoors and indoor. Probably looking for just some speakers really at the time but all feedback is accepted. I've been out of the scene for so long so I figured it'd be easier to ask someone who is up and up on their research.

Thanks!
 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 3:11 am
What's your budget?
 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 4:49 am
VDJ RonPRO InfinityMember since 2010
The Peavey PV900 is too small, you need the PV1500 for 4 ohm, or the PV2600 for 8 ohm speakers. All speakers rated at 500 W RMS.
You need to be able to output 1000W RMS in total.
I use the Peavey Impulse 1012 plastic 12" speakers which are 5 star top rated all over the Internet.
They provide power, yet are very light, and mobile.
This will just about do 200 people at a push.

You need to be very careful when working out doors, it's very easy to overdrive your speakers and burn out the voice coils.
The music drifts away on the wind.

 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 8:37 am
You can get a pair of 15' amplified speakers and just one amplified subwoofer electro voice are very decent in sound and quality and budget friendly
 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 1:04 pm
Also get a pioneer sbdj controller for like 250
 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 1:05 pm
And the most important get vdj pro
 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 1:07 pm
speaker selection is always a difficult choice.....

and its also about what sort of sound your trying to create

200 people in a room is very different from 200 people on a tightly packed dance floor!

and playing modern dance and wanting that deep base is very different from playing 60' and motown

if you want a bit of versatility I would consider a good all rounder probably 12 inch with a compression horn in a spacious room 300w rms would be fine.

you could add to this a couple of 18 inch subs and a separate 400w rms amp and active crossover, this would give you 700w per channel system for more denser crowd

outside is another matter covering a large area would be better with multiple speakers, on a stage you may get away with your indoor setup, but its not going to have the same sort of impact as when its used indoors.

one thing is certain , crowds absorb sound, the denser they are packed the more power you will need.

never under rate your amplifier its very easy to damage good well rated speakers with an under rated amp, basically as you try to drive the system harder the amp will start to clip (clipping is when the audio waveform loses its peaks because the amp cant supply enough voltage) this means the top of the waveform is DC, DC heats the voice coils very quickly, which melts them or the surrounding wax and they fall to bits or start rasping on the magnet / support, its easy to not notice the onset of clipping , especially if you amp is tucked away under the table. I have a large vu in my rack calibrated to 0db !

I always like a nice balance sound and with a good eq I can get excellent sound quality using even my old speakers.

for small house parties I normally a single pair of celestion SR1's, mkII dual 8 inch dual cone

small events I parallel two pairs of these, they are rated at 350w a cab

smaller events with a dance floor 2 pairs of sr1's and 2 x 15 inch sub , bi amped ,

for larger events I still use my good old ohm , they are getting a bit tatty now, but are always covered, 4 cabs each with 15, 10 and compression horn, big and bulky heavy as lead, but they still sound great with a good solid base and sweet midrange,

bigger events, just hire it !,




 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 5:01 pm
VDJ RonPRO InfinityMember since 2010
When Peavey UK existed I used to occasionally visit them in Kettering.
Their engineers contradicted the common wisdom that an amp needs plenty of headroom.
They felt a 1000 W RMS amp was fine for a pair of 12" 500 W RMS 4 ohm speakers?
I trusted them rather than the Internet forums, but who is correct ?

They were aware that I was doing karaoke.
 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 5:45 pm
I'd say that for most scenarios they're probably right.

Think about it - how often are you really going to run a pair of 500W speakers flat out at five hundred watts?

You'd probably be very surprised at how little current is drawn by amps & speakers at a reasonable volume.

Take the typical efficiency of a DJ style PA speaker - around 99dB/W. Ninety nine decibels is pretty loud (think drill/mower/motorbike) and it's being produced by one watt of amp power. OK so the amp will use more than 1W of mains juice to produce that watt, but it's still pretty insignificant.

The "common wisdom" is probably better applied to amps in a club style environment, where the kit may be pushed harder.
 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 6:12 pm
Thank you all for the feedback! budget is around $1000 for now. I will be looking into those Peavey 12" and 15" as well as some electro voice same size. Any other recommendations?
 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 7:59 pm
I'm hoping to get at least the two speakers and maybe a sub/amp combo or separate within the $1000 budget. 200 is probably the max venue I'll do. I'm too busy to hit the clubs on the weekends anymore but private parties and weddings that include the all different music variations from top hits and classics is what will be most likely the main source of music requested of me.
 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 8:03 pm
Peavey pro 15 will do the job but have a look at these they are very clean, very powerful speakers RCF ART 712-A MK II or Electro voice they are good as well ,the best way is to go and listen all them by your self I would suggest this rcf and EV
 

Inviato Tue 24 Nov 15 @ 11:42 pm
bigron1 wrote :
When Peavey UK existed I used to occasionally visit them in Kettering.
Their engineers contradicted the common wisdom that an amp needs plenty of headroom.
They felt a 1000 W RMS amp was fine for a pair of 12" 500 W RMS 4 ohm speakers?
I trusted them rather than the Internet forums, but who is correct ?

They were aware that I was doing karaoke.


Peavey are correct (as you can be)

its harder to damage speakers with a larger amp, no in fact ignore that, it would be better to say its easier to damage speakers with an under rated amp, clipping kills speakers!



 

Inviato Thu 26 Nov 15 @ 4:56 pm
A well designed amp won't let a clipped signal reach a speaker these days, due to competent limiters.
I know this is probably not available to all of you, but I always test my amps how they behave in extreme levels regarding voltage and current limiting.
Current-limiting is just as bad as voltage-clipping, since the voice-coil actually sees no difference between these two modes.
 

Inviato Thu 26 Nov 15 @ 5:27 pm
if your finding it hard to get your head around speaker power levels there is a good article here

http://www.psbspeakers.com/articles/Guide-to-Speaker-Specifications

the sensitivity of a speaker is basically a guide to how efficient it is turning electrical power to sound, the db scale is also logarithmic so it also take a little thought to get your head round that too.

here is a exert from the article to give you an idea......



Consider this: If 0 dB represents the threshold of hearing, then what are other common volume levels of sound?

A Whisper: 15-25 dB
Home or Office Background Noise: 40-60 dB
Normal Speaking Voice: 65-70 dB
Orchestral Climax: 105 dB
Rock Concert: 120+ dB
Pain Threshold: 130 dB
Jet Aircraft: 140-180 dB


and.....



simple point of reference for a speaker with a Sensitivity Rating of 87 dB.


Power in watts

Volume in dB

watts db
1 87
2 90
4 93
10 97
20 100
40 103
100 107
200 110
400 113

and of course this is measured at 1m away from the speaker

the sound level will drop by 6db every time you double the distance from the source so if the speaker produces 87db at 1m, 2 meters away from the speaker the sound will be 81db, at 4 meters away from the speaker 75db


 

Inviato Thu 26 Nov 15 @ 5:31 pm
An interesting fact that we use in our calculation of heatsink requirements for PA amps, is a typical rock concert will generally provide 1/8 of amplifiers maximum clipping level as average power.
Meaning that a 10kW amp does produce an average level of 1250W, even if it's driven into brief clipping during peaks.
This is very important numbers when designing power distribution for very large PA systems that many times draws more current than the venue has available.
This leads to the need of adding diesel generators externally to help the venue cope with the demand.
Of course, lighting systems are much worse power-hungry units compared to the sound equipment.
 

Inviato Thu 26 Nov 15 @ 7:44 pm
bigron1 wrote :
When Peavey UK existed I used to occasionally visit them in Kettering.
Their engineers contradicted the common wisdom that an amp needs plenty of headroom.
They felt a 1000 W RMS amp was fine for a pair of 12" 500 W RMS 4 ohm speakers?


That's spot on. I have had two Peavey CS1000x amps since 1999. One runs a pair of 15" subs and the other runs a pair of 12" tops. Both amps are a higher rating than the speakers but I have had this rig for 16 years and not a single problem at all. As long as the DDT on the amps doesn't engage then there's no likelihood of damage to the speakers.

It's getting to know your system and how far you can push it.

 

Inviato Thu 26 Nov 15 @ 7:57 pm
VDJ RonPRO InfinityMember since 2010
Peavey messenger pro 15 mk2 4ohm speakers would match your amp. They may leave you a little light on power, but I think you will manage.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Peavey-Messenger-Pro-Speaker-Single/dp/B003SQKG48
I'm surprised that the reviews for these speakers are so good, they are very much a budget item.

Later you could get the matching bass bins, and a second amp for bigger jobs.

 

Inviato Fri 27 Nov 15 @ 11:45 am
So i've been looking around and I found a deal on some JBL Eon 615. Anyone ever use these? Decent?
 

Inviato Mon 30 Nov 15 @ 12:09 am
A friend of mine uses the JBLs in his mobile DJ rig with an EV powered sub, they sound good. Watch the eq, the horns can be harsh. The 15s won't have as punchy of a midrange as some of the powered 12's on the market (RCF, QSC etc) but you will likely be the only one that can tell the difference. I would listen to as many different models as you can before buying. That being said, JBL has never let me down.
 

Inviato Mon 30 Nov 15 @ 6:12 pm
95%