Dan (djtouchdan)
Thats great to hear Les.
I know some people complain about the amount of options VDJ8 has and the fact it should work out the box, to a degree i agree.
But with different machines and different working atmospheres like yours it great that with a couple of quick tweaks in the software (no registry tool anymore) you can adjust things to suit you and get a great nights performance!!
Nice - :-)
I know some people complain about the amount of options VDJ8 has and the fact it should work out the box, to a degree i agree.
But with different machines and different working atmospheres like yours it great that with a couple of quick tweaks in the software (no registry tool anymore) you can adjust things to suit you and get a great nights performance!!
Nice - :-)
Inviato Sat 28 Jun 14 @ 4:22 am
Don Moir
Would probably be best to set your videoFPS to 30. That goes thru a different pipeline and should be fine. This allows for smoother video. The stuff the audience sees.
skinFPS ?? well that should not even be there but it is what it is. Wish they would just optimize drawing and get rid of it.
If you are having problems with the videoFPS, maybe you should consider a faster machine. Video decoding and display along with everything else going on can tax a machine and I am sure you want to show your best.
For an example, neither of the above is a problem on either of my i7 machines. It's flawless. Only a problem on my slower machine.
skinFPS ?? well that should not even be there but it is what it is. Wish they would just optimize drawing and get rid of it.
If you are having problems with the videoFPS, maybe you should consider a faster machine. Video decoding and display along with everything else going on can tax a machine and I am sure you want to show your best.
For an example, neither of the above is a problem on either of my i7 machines. It's flawless. Only a problem on my slower machine.
Inviato Sat 28 Jun 14 @ 8:57 am
RadiOnlineChile
videoFPS should depend of the country, because in some countries is used 30 and in others is 25, like NTSC and PAL in the past.
skinFPS should be in "15", to avoid high CPU usage, until the VDJ development team fix it.
songLoadPriority should be in "Idle", which is the proper value for any machine to avoid high CPU usage when loading a song.
skinFPS should be in "15", to avoid high CPU usage, until the VDJ development team fix it.
songLoadPriority should be in "Idle", which is the proper value for any machine to avoid high CPU usage when loading a song.
Inviato Sat 28 Jun 14 @ 10:48 am
A Man and His Music
I have been watching this thread, and have not had any of these issues. I do 7 & 8 hour video gigs, three nights a week, and my cpu barely moves. My video FPS is 30, my skin FPS is 30, and my songloadpriority is set to normal. I'm using an I7, with stock cooling, in a desktop. I may get a 70 degree warning twice a year, but that was on 7 also. Then I blow out the dust from my machine, when I get home.
Inviato Sun 29 Jun 14 @ 12:43 am
djles.co.uk
Don, I don't have a problem with the video output, I only changed the videoFPS because I'm in the UK and PAL is normally 24 FPS. I was trying every possibility to reduce the temperature as the laptop was hitting 95-100C and getting sluggish before crashing. Also, here in the UK every club/pub I've worked in use Composite Video for distribution which degrades the signal and end up with slightly blurry edges to text etc. on the external screens. Now I've got the temperatures down I may put back some of these settings one by one and see what, if any, difference it makes. Bearing in mind I'm actually DJing and my attention is on my job.
I have occasionally checked the processor and it doesn't exceed 27% total. It hovers generally between 5-15% when everything is running.
My MBP is a 15" 2.66 Ghz Intel Core i7 with 4 Gb 1067 MHz DDR3 memory. Nvidia GeForce GT 330M 512 Mb.
I have occasionally checked the processor and it doesn't exceed 27% total. It hovers generally between 5-15% when everything is running.
My MBP is a 15" 2.66 Ghz Intel Core i7 with 4 Gb 1067 MHz DDR3 memory. Nvidia GeForce GT 330M 512 Mb.
Inviato Sun 29 Jun 14 @ 9:34 am
Don Moir
Thanks Soulman, I was wondering what the computer video frame rate had to do with the national standard TV rate. I figured it had to do with some composite video thing.
Heat is a problem for sure. Laptops are the worse case. High heat can also slow your machine down in addition to other problems.
The reason I mention the videoFPS for the most part, is that plugins only get called to draw at that rate. Non animating graphics like scrolling text take a lot of updates for smooth scrolling. Video or graphics that are animating are not effected as much. The animation fools your eyes to a certain degree.
So plugins are at the mercy of VDJ at the rate (videoFPS) that they can draw.
You can stop the VDJ skin redrawing by minimizing VDJ. You probably don't want to do that but it can help.
Heat is a problem for sure. Laptops are the worse case. High heat can also slow your machine down in addition to other problems.
The reason I mention the videoFPS for the most part, is that plugins only get called to draw at that rate. Non animating graphics like scrolling text take a lot of updates for smooth scrolling. Video or graphics that are animating are not effected as much. The animation fools your eyes to a certain degree.
So plugins are at the mercy of VDJ at the rate (videoFPS) that they can draw.
You can stop the VDJ skin redrawing by minimizing VDJ. You probably don't want to do that but it can help.
Inviato Sun 29 Jun 14 @ 10:15 am
Adion
I would recommend to keep the videoFPS at the default 30.
30 is actually used as 'half the video output refresh rate', so it should work anywhere (if your video output is set to 60Hz it will be exactly 30, but if it is 50Hz for PAL output it will be exactly 25fps)
30 is actually used as 'half the video output refresh rate', so it should work anywhere (if your video output is set to 60Hz it will be exactly 30, but if it is 50Hz for PAL output it will be exactly 25fps)
Inviato Mon 30 Jun 14 @ 2:28 am
DJWESTBANKPOPA
How can you find the fps and adjust it?
Inviato Mon 30 Jun 14 @ 10:17 pm
PachN
Go to settings - options, make sure you check the advanced settings checkbox,
search for FPS.
search for FPS.
Inviato Tue 01 Jul 14 @ 2:38 am
djles.co.uk
Options with Advanced ticked;
search for skinFPS=30
thats the default setting
Whoops, touche lol
search for skinFPS=30
thats the default setting
Whoops, touche lol
Inviato Tue 01 Jul 14 @ 2:40 am
Don Moir
The skin drawing and whatever else they are doing related to the skin, also effects smoothness of playback. When a video is playing or some animation is going on you probably won't see this. Very noticeable when trying to scroll items horizontally though.
Using build 1870, which has more consistent timing, for the best results, I had to set videoFPS to 60 and have the skin minimized. With these settings, I see very good results in the smoothness of scrolling items. With the skinFPS set to 30, and not minimized, I see a constant jitter. With the skinFPS set to one, not minimized, I see a jitter once per second, which is the rate skin is redrawing.
This is on fast machine and CPU is hardly breathing. 0 to 2 percent, skin up or down.
Tearing and other things come into play when some effect takes to long to do it's thing. This computer never got above 5 percent CPU no matter what, but the tearing and jitter were very visible under some circumstances.
Also the results seem not quite as good when full screen. In non full screen mode with video window same size as full screen results are better.
Using build 1870, which has more consistent timing, for the best results, I had to set videoFPS to 60 and have the skin minimized. With these settings, I see very good results in the smoothness of scrolling items. With the skinFPS set to 30, and not minimized, I see a constant jitter. With the skinFPS set to one, not minimized, I see a jitter once per second, which is the rate skin is redrawing.
This is on fast machine and CPU is hardly breathing. 0 to 2 percent, skin up or down.
Tearing and other things come into play when some effect takes to long to do it's thing. This computer never got above 5 percent CPU no matter what, but the tearing and jitter were very visible under some circumstances.
Also the results seem not quite as good when full screen. In non full screen mode with video window same size as full screen results are better.
Inviato Tue 01 Jul 14 @ 11:03 am
Adion
What kind of video card do you have?
Inviato Tue 01 Jul 14 @ 11:42 am
Don Moir
NVIDIA GeForce GT 630. The good card that was in the machine melted on me literally :) I have another machine here I need to unbox and I will test with that.
I will post a test case here so you can try it on your machine as well. It's good at detecting things like this. Just a scrolling image that is stretched to the height of the display. If there is any tearing or jitter it will show you that.
The jitter seems to come and go. I just tested it again with better results, but always very best with skin minimized and videoFPS at 60.
I will post a test case here so you can try it on your machine as well. It's good at detecting things like this. Just a scrolling image that is stretched to the height of the display. If there is any tearing or jitter it will show you that.
The jitter seems to come and go. I just tested it again with better results, but always very best with skin minimized and videoFPS at 60.
Inviato Tue 01 Jul 14 @ 12:07 pm
Don Moir
The zip contains EssentialVisualsBeta8T.dll and ScrollTest.lay.
Unzip and place dll into the VideoEffect folder. In EV click Load and load ScrollTest.lay. Activate.
ScrollTest.lay contains a single horizontally scrolling image that stretches to the height of the display. It will pick up any jitter or tearing easily. The image is the Pangolin girl we have on T-shirts etc.
Try with skin minimized or not and videoFPS set to 30 and videoFPS set to 60.
I see best results with skin minimized, videoFPS at 60, and not full screen. I am not using a second monitor. Had 2 of them go out on me recently but I will be able to test that later. Using i7 16GB for testing.
Try running EV stand alone, EV and video running, EV and milkdrop running.
Let me know what you see.
http://sms.pangolin.com/temp/EssentialVisualsBeta8T.zip
Unzip and place dll into the VideoEffect folder. In EV click Load and load ScrollTest.lay. Activate.
ScrollTest.lay contains a single horizontally scrolling image that stretches to the height of the display. It will pick up any jitter or tearing easily. The image is the Pangolin girl we have on T-shirts etc.
Try with skin minimized or not and videoFPS set to 30 and videoFPS set to 60.
I see best results with skin minimized, videoFPS at 60, and not full screen. I am not using a second monitor. Had 2 of them go out on me recently but I will be able to test that later. Using i7 16GB for testing.
Try running EV stand alone, EV and video running, EV and milkdrop running.
Let me know what you see.
http://sms.pangolin.com/temp/EssentialVisualsBeta8T.zip
Inviato Tue 01 Jul 14 @ 1:44 pm
Sonido Alto Voltaje
Don Moir wrote :
The skin drawing and whatever else they are doing related to the skin, also effects smoothness of playback. When a video is playing or some animation is going on you probably won't see this. Very noticeable when trying to scroll items horizontally though.
I've noticed this while playing Karaoke.
Inviato Tue 01 Jul 14 @ 3:55 pm
dcomo
CPU usage now lower than VDJ7? Can it be? Perhaps...
On my MacBookAir (mid-2013, i7), with some of the tweaks explained on the forum (mainly FPS 20), here's my CPU temps:
(Using VDJ8 1878.719)
CPU 1 Core - 49 C
CPU 2 Core - 50 C
Fan RPM - 1183RPM
In VDJ7 on the same machine (V7.4.1), here's the temps:
CPU 1 Core - 56 C
CPU 2 Core - 59 C
Fan RPM - 1178RPM
I still want to test this on my audio MBP's later on tonight, however I'm hoping that the results are similar.
On my MacBookAir (mid-2013, i7), with some of the tweaks explained on the forum (mainly FPS 20), here's my CPU temps:
(Using VDJ8 1878.719)
CPU 1 Core - 49 C
CPU 2 Core - 50 C
Fan RPM - 1183RPM
In VDJ7 on the same machine (V7.4.1), here's the temps:
CPU 1 Core - 56 C
CPU 2 Core - 59 C
Fan RPM - 1178RPM
I still want to test this on my audio MBP's later on tonight, however I'm hoping that the results are similar.
Inviato Fri 11 Jul 14 @ 9:55 am
dcomo
Turns out the CPU temps are lowering, however the GPU temps still spike. Still looks like bugs in the rendering engine with hw acceleration perhaps.
Inviato Sat 12 Jul 14 @ 1:41 pm
Don Moir
GPU's can get very hot. I mentioned before that I had one literally melt on me on a fast machine and in a tower computer. I had the melted GPU card hanging on the wall for awhile :)
You would need to compare your GPU temps with some other application like VDJ7 doing video so you can get an accurate comparison versus VDJ8 if you have not done that already.
You would need to compare your GPU temps with some other application like VDJ7 doing video so you can get an accurate comparison versus VDJ8 if you have not done that already.
Inviato Sat 12 Jul 14 @ 2:22 pm
Don Moir
Had a chance to test VDJ8 build 1890 on another i7 machine with an Intel HD Graphics 4000 GPU.
Using the ScrollTest.lay file with Essential Visuals for testing which you can download below. The ScrollTest.lay file contains a single scrolling image and will display at the height of the video display. It will easily show tearing and jitter. You can't tell these things from straight up video.
o - with skin up at 30 FPS and Video at 30 FPS CPU at 6 percent - smooth except when full screen. Full screen shows some tearing and jitter
o - with skin minimized and Video at 30 FPS CPU at 2 percent - not as smooth as when skin up - that's strange isn't it?
o - with skin up at 30 FPS and Video at 60 FPS CPU at 7 percent - smooth except when full screen. Full screen shows some tearing and jitter
o - with skin minimized and Video at 60 FPS CPU at 2 percent - smooth and no tearing full screen and not full screen
Andrew had said this was fixed. It will never be fixed until you stop drawing the entire skin as some FPS. Draw only dirty regions at some rate and get rid of Skin FPS. Appears you are using Direct3D for skin drawing. 1) don't draw the entire display when not necessary. 2) beware of pixel shaders. 3) use SetScissorsRect where appropriate.
Generally, much better when skin is minimized. This whole thing does not leave you with a warm fuzzy feeling about things to put this politely you know.
Essential Visuals is here:
http://sms.pangolin.com/temp/EssentialVisualsBeta8.zip
ScrollTest.zip is here. Unzip. Run EV and load ScrollTest.lay. Activate. Shows tearing and jitter easily.
http://sms.pangolin.com/temp/ScrollTest.zip
Using the ScrollTest.lay file with Essential Visuals for testing which you can download below. The ScrollTest.lay file contains a single scrolling image and will display at the height of the video display. It will easily show tearing and jitter. You can't tell these things from straight up video.
o - with skin up at 30 FPS and Video at 30 FPS CPU at 6 percent - smooth except when full screen. Full screen shows some tearing and jitter
o - with skin minimized and Video at 30 FPS CPU at 2 percent - not as smooth as when skin up - that's strange isn't it?
o - with skin up at 30 FPS and Video at 60 FPS CPU at 7 percent - smooth except when full screen. Full screen shows some tearing and jitter
o - with skin minimized and Video at 60 FPS CPU at 2 percent - smooth and no tearing full screen and not full screen
Andrew had said this was fixed. It will never be fixed until you stop drawing the entire skin as some FPS. Draw only dirty regions at some rate and get rid of Skin FPS. Appears you are using Direct3D for skin drawing. 1) don't draw the entire display when not necessary. 2) beware of pixel shaders. 3) use SetScissorsRect where appropriate.
Generally, much better when skin is minimized. This whole thing does not leave you with a warm fuzzy feeling about things to put this politely you know.
Essential Visuals is here:
http://sms.pangolin.com/temp/EssentialVisualsBeta8.zip
ScrollTest.zip is here. Unzip. Run EV and load ScrollTest.lay. Activate. Shows tearing and jitter easily.
http://sms.pangolin.com/temp/ScrollTest.zip
Inviato Fri 18 Jul 14 @ 3:58 pm
locoDog
Very technical stuff, thanks for your research, Atomix staff need to chime in here, when V7 could adequately handle coloured wave forms, and hold a FPS good enough that skin FPS wasn't even considered as an option, why is it such a big issue now?
It's pretty terrible that sound processing nor video processing is what is killing machines, it's a High quality skin (that is just cosmetic)
What a dj wants in order
1 Reliability
2 (public) output quality
3 What the dj sees
Given a choice between HQ and choppy against low quality and smooth the choice is universal.
It's pretty terrible that sound processing nor video processing is what is killing machines, it's a High quality skin (that is just cosmetic)
What a dj wants in order
1 Reliability
2 (public) output quality
3 What the dj sees
Given a choice between HQ and choppy against low quality and smooth the choice is universal.
Inviato Fri 18 Jul 14 @ 4:35 pm
