cpoynter
I've recently moved from Rekordbox to Virtual DJ. One thing I have noticed is that the beatgrid analyzing algorithm was a lot more accurate in Rekordbox, when it comes to songs with variable beatgrids.
Here's an example: Lil Boo Thang, by Paul Russell, has a tempo that varies slightly throughout the song. After I analyzed it in Rekordbox (both dynamic track analysis and cloud beatgrid data collection enabled), the beatgrid was perfect. When I played it, the live BPM counter was constantly fluctuating between 113-115 (down to the hundreths decimal place) to keep it locked in.
After I analyzed it in Virtual DJ, the BPM starts drifting after about 0m:39s, and is totally off for the rest of the song, due to the small fluctuations in the song's tempo. I tried a few different ways of analyzing including using the "experimental" bpm analyzer as well as analyzing for multiple BPMs, but none of them made a difference.
The amount of work I spent on beatgridding dynamic songs in Rekordbox was minimal, but in VDJ it looks like I have a LOT of work ahead of me.
Perhaps the fine folks at VDJ could figure out a way to make the beatgrid analyzing algorithm better, like Rekordbox?
Here's an example: Lil Boo Thang, by Paul Russell, has a tempo that varies slightly throughout the song. After I analyzed it in Rekordbox (both dynamic track analysis and cloud beatgrid data collection enabled), the beatgrid was perfect. When I played it, the live BPM counter was constantly fluctuating between 113-115 (down to the hundreths decimal place) to keep it locked in.
After I analyzed it in Virtual DJ, the BPM starts drifting after about 0m:39s, and is totally off for the rest of the song, due to the small fluctuations in the song's tempo. I tried a few different ways of analyzing including using the "experimental" bpm analyzer as well as analyzing for multiple BPMs, but none of them made a difference.
The amount of work I spent on beatgridding dynamic songs in Rekordbox was minimal, but in VDJ it looks like I have a LOT of work ahead of me.
Perhaps the fine folks at VDJ could figure out a way to make the beatgrid analyzing algorithm better, like Rekordbox?
Inviato Sun 10 Mar 24 @ 1:51 pm
groovindj
I agree the analysis in VDJ could do with improving. The default is to take an average of the tempo and place a fixed beat grid onto the track. Of course this only works accurately if the music itself has a fixed tempo.
The "Variable BPM" option is a little misleading as it's really only intended for tracks that switch BPM rather than constantly varying. Using that method involves manually placing markers and is very time consuming.
Since the Fluid Beatgrid system in Algoriddim DJay Pro 5 has gone down a storm, hopefully it will eventually be introduced in other software.
VDJ users have been asking for improvements in this dept for many years. I think now would be a good time for these limitations to be addressed. Here's hoping.
The "Variable BPM" option is a little misleading as it's really only intended for tracks that switch BPM rather than constantly varying. Using that method involves manually placing markers and is very time consuming.
Since the Fluid Beatgrid system in Algoriddim DJay Pro 5 has gone down a storm, hopefully it will eventually be introduced in other software.
VDJ users have been asking for improvements in this dept for many years. I think now would be a good time for these limitations to be addressed. Here's hoping.
Inviato Sun 10 Mar 24 @ 3:25 pm
Niels (cph)
groovindj wrote :
Since the Fluid Beatgrid system in Algoriddim DJay Pro 5 has gone down a storm, hopefully it will eventually be introduced in other software.
VDJ users have been asking for improvements in this dept for many years. I think now would be a good time for these limitations to be addressed. Here's hoping.
VDJ users have been asking for improvements in this dept for many years. I think now would be a good time for these limitations to be addressed. Here's hoping.
Spot on! I have been playing around with Algoriddim's DJay lately, and that new beatgridding algorithm/AI is absolutely magic.
Atomix: Please, pretty please with sugar on top, make this a priority..!
Inviato Mon 11 Mar 24 @ 1:42 pm
groovindj
Indeed - it was enough to convince to pay their subscription, just for that one feature.
It doesn't come close to VDJ in many other ways, but being able to accurately grid tracks like that is a huge step forward.
It doesn't come close to VDJ in many other ways, but being able to accurately grid tracks like that is a huge step forward.
Inviato Mon 11 Mar 24 @ 2:10 pm
djsherz
+1 for that feature here! As a wedding jock I play a lot of old music that often doesn't align too well to a constant beatgrid. This would be a real game changer for those of us who play a lot of old soul and disco classics!
Inviato Tue 02 Apr 24 @ 4:07 pm
DJ Blaze BTBE
+1 please we need fluid beatgrid to much wasted time on manually fixing what vdj got wrong
Inviato Sat 13 Apr 24 @ 3:49 pm
Sounds of Double J
Most definitely, I paid the Djay Pro subscription just to have this feature but they have nothing on Virtual DJ. I feel that VDJ are already the best out there but If they make this happen - they will be unstoppable!!! PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE!!!!
Inviato Thu 23 May 24 @ 4:04 pm
groovindj
Sounds of Double J wrote :
I paid the Djay Pro subscription just to have this feature
Same here. Apart from that, DJay Pro is quite poor in comparison to other software.
I see the feature has also just been added to another program recently.
Inviato Thu 23 May 24 @ 5:29 pm
gvaste
+1 to improve the beatgrid overall
i need to adjust the beatgrids almost ALWAYS
i need to adjust the beatgrids almost ALWAYS
Inviato Fri 24 May 24 @ 8:19 pm
djjoe21
I checked out the demo of a new DJ DAW called DJ Studio and the way they do beat grids in that program is phenomenal. Super easy to use. Not a fan of this type of software but some very nice features.
Inviato Fri 24 May 24 @ 11:25 pm
chirro
For me, fluid beatgrid is the most important improvement that has been made in the DJ world in many years. If Virtual DJ incorporates this, it will be the best DJ program in the world.
Inviato Tue 28 May 24 @ 3:24 pm
DJ VinylTouch
user21308771 wrote :
For me, fluid beatgrid is the most important improvement that has been made in the DJ world in many years.
I (personally) don't believe this to be true...it literally doesn't change anything about the way you play, it really just lessens/eliminates some prep time. The AI-based stems extraction, imo, is the biggest innovation to date...it's made blends/edits which were previously impossible without having real studio stems now a mainstream thing, and has completely changed the way the average person thinks about/executes mixes.
However, I agree it is a very helpful addition (proper automatic BPM gridding analysis with little to no errors) and would love to see the fluid beatgridding come to VirtualDJ, and if possible, in a way that keeps compatibility with tools that already utilize BPM information from VirtualDJ (e.g. SoundSwitch), and is not too heavy compared to the current analysis (given it could propbably would be AI based too).
Inviato Wed 29 May 24 @ 1:00 am
groovindj
DJ VinylTouch wrote :
doesn't change anything
I think it does. It allows you to mix the previously unmixable, without all the nudging.
You can just blend the tracks and not have to worry.
Quantised hot cues will always be in the right place. Loops will just work. FX will be on beat.
For open format DJs who play music from all decades and genres this is a killer feature.
Inviato Wed 29 May 24 @ 9:08 am
kradcliffe
Does it alleviate the need for those Mastermix quantized edits then? Not that I like them anyway.
Inviato Wed 29 May 24 @ 9:17 am
groovindj
Well it's kind of the opposite of those!
There are two ways of dealing with variable BPM tracks.
One is to warp them, to straighten out the tempo changes (what Dakeyne has been doing) and make the track fit the grid. The other is the DJay Pro method - make the grids fit the track.
The warping method gets complaints from some about removing the "feel" of the tracks. I wouldn't say it matters that much, certainly to the average punter. I can play my warped version of Car Wash (a constant 116) and nobody bats an eye.
It's when changes are made to the original structure that it becomes obvious (like some of the Mastermix ones).
The DJay Pro method keeps the feel.
There are two ways of dealing with variable BPM tracks.
One is to warp them, to straighten out the tempo changes (what Dakeyne has been doing) and make the track fit the grid. The other is the DJay Pro method - make the grids fit the track.
The warping method gets complaints from some about removing the "feel" of the tracks. I wouldn't say it matters that much, certainly to the average punter. I can play my warped version of Car Wash (a constant 116) and nobody bats an eye.
It's when changes are made to the original structure that it becomes obvious (like some of the Mastermix ones).
The DJay Pro method keeps the feel.
Inviato Wed 29 May 24 @ 9:33 am
kradcliffe
groovindj wrote :
It's when changes are made to the original structure that it becomes obvious (like some of the Mastermix ones)
Yes I have listened to some and they do sound a bit "off" although there are some DJs out there that HAVE to mix everything together so it keeps them happy.
Inviato Wed 29 May 24 @ 9:40 am
groovindj
I've recently been watching YouTube videos that discuss songs which are not just bog standard 4/4 one key one tempo. They tend to be classic hits too.
One channel is called David Bennett Piano.
One channel is called David Bennett Piano.
Inviato Wed 29 May 24 @ 10:01 am
