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Forum: General Discussion

Topic: Thanks for the advice everyone, but accelerated video still not working

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Well I just got my shiny new Dell laptop, and I must say it's a beauty. 1900x1200 widescreen LCD is sooo nice. I was pretty excited to finally get the laptop so I can start trying out video, but alas hardware acceleration still does not work.

And someone told me that this is supposed to be cheaper than a Pioneer DJ DVD player. For all of you keeping score, this is the third computer I've purchased trying to get music videos working. Accelerated video still does not work. This new laptop I just got today has a nvidia geforce go 6800. So $2,000 later, this laptop is no better than the other laptop I just bought a few months ago.

Just venting a bit over how frustrating this is. Please don't recommend that I build a shuttle PC. I am sticking with laptops. This laptop in fact. When I finally decide to do video, I am buying a Pioneer. I'll probably thank myself later, in that I didn't chase this by getting yet another computer.
 

Inviato Wed 30 Nov 05 @ 2:38 am
DJ-ALFPRO InfinityModeratorMember since 2005
I can't belive it, 6800 and it is still buggy?! This is not a video card issue. Hard disks are a lot slower on laptops. You are a VIP member Vantine, why don't you try get with Atomix people, and see is that video working in VDJ, or what??? I think this should remain "audio only" program, and built some other software for the video. Should be easier to sort this bugs out. This way, program becomes just more complicated and closer to our friend "Murphy" (and his law, you know what I mean ;) )!
Just my thoughts.
Good luck
 

Inviato Wed 30 Nov 05 @ 7:12 am
You can't get video mixing to work or what?
Suggested a laptop with nVidia Go 6800 to a friend. Maybe I should take back that suggestion...
 

Inviato Wed 30 Nov 05 @ 7:41 am
Anewsome, I have seen your setup and can tell you are serious. So what I want to know is; Do you want to do video, or do you want a laptop? If you want to do video, then do what's needed to accomplish that goal. I am not that sharp when it comes to computers, but know enough that laptop users, have more issues and limitations, then desktop users. I have only used 2 DJ programs, and can only speak about them. I am on both forums, and can tell you laptop users have the most problems. There are also laptop users, that don't have any problems. You don't want to bring a desktop, but are considering the Pioneer players? I don't get it. That's 2 players, 2 boxes to carry them, a video mixer and a box to carry that. You already have a mixer, but you're still bringing your 2 CD players, and a laptop. Now lets not forget all those DVD's you will have to bring. At 3 grand a piece, plus I have to look through all those DVD's is going backwards to me. I have a SFF I built. It is not a Shuttle. It has 3 hard drives in it. A 60 for programs and 2 120s for music. I have 2 200 externals for videos. I have 800 videos on 1 hd, and it is not full yet. I am going to build another one, with larger hard drives, and bring both. I already have 2 monitors, and may run them both at the same time. As far as making this an audio only program, Why? The only reason I bought VDJ, is for the video feature, and it works fine for me. Yeah it has a few bugs, but so does every product out there. At least they are working on them, and the upgrades are free.
 

Inviato Wed 30 Nov 05 @ 9:23 am
I own and use an Acer 1801 and VDJ works just fine on that.. I cannot understand why this would not work..
 

Inviato Wed 30 Nov 05 @ 1:38 pm
all imaginable codec's etc etc you have downloaded / uploaded, you have reinstalled your 3.2 program making sure there was not a instalation glitch and you have set your lappie to best performance not asthetics incl. turning down the colour to perhaps 24bit true from 64 ?!? and its still glitchy!?!
 

Inviato Wed 30 Nov 05 @ 2:18 pm
long winded but proves its not your laptop !! gots to be somewhere else !!!!!!
settings or something trivial that has just been over looked!!!!!!
sorry cant post addresses yet.....i think ???


by:Peter K. Sheerin
Laptops Power Up for CAD
Makers of laptop computers have billed their high-end models as desktop replacements for years, but, until now, the lack of real 3D acceleration tempered those claims. The speed and advanced features of these 850MHz laptops from Compaq, Dell and IBM make them serious contenders for use with power-demanding CAD apps.
Laptops have always been a compromise between conflicting desires-between speed and battery life and between features and weight. With the introduction of Intel's SpeedStep technology last year and the advent of the first 32MB graphics system in the Dell laptop reviewed here, some of those compromises are starting to diminish. But perhaps the biggest news is that with the advent of Windows 2000 Professional, power laptop users finally have the best of both worlds-the laptop friendliness of Windows 98 and the stability and performance of Windows NT 4.0.

With these laptops running at 850MHz when plugged into A/C power, I expected all of them to be powerhouses in our benchmark suite. But I had almost completely forgotten how much a difference the amount of memory available to the graphics system makes on 3D performance, especially when running these programs on laptops. The Compaq I received came with 8MB of video RAM and the IBM came with 16MB, but the Dell came equipped with a full 32MB of RAM, and the first AGP 4x graphics engine on a laptop. While the Compaq and IBM units performed well in the 2D-only tests, they didn't do as well in any of the 3D tests-just like every other laptop that I've tested. But the Dell, with its hot new graphics, proved to be capable in both the 2D and 3D tests. I expect more laptops to be using the same or similar graphics technology in the near future, but for now the Dell is the only game in town.

SpeedStep and Performance
Although all three of these laptops operate at 850MHz on A/C power and automatically drop down to 700MHz when on battery power, only two of them do so using Intel's highly-touted SpeedStep mobile processor technology. The Dell Inspiron 8000 pushes performance just far enough that none of the currently available mobile chipsets will suffice-so instead Dell pairs the same mobile Pentium III processor used in the other two laptops tested here with a desktop chipset (Intel's 815e AGP chipset). This means that the unit's BIOS is the only way to control the processor speed (and thus battery usage) and limits the switch between performance and power-saving modes to occurring only when the power source is changed from A/C to battery or vice versa.

The Compaq and IBM units, which fully implement the SpeedStep technology, allow the user to override the performance settings at any time-or applications that are SpeedStep aware to boost the processor speed temporarily while running on battery power.

Mobile Graphics
The once glutted laptop graphic chip market has been reduced to essentially just one-ATI Technologies. Each of the laptops here uses a different model of ATI graphics chip, with noticeably different results. But NVIDIA, one of the leading desktop graphics card and chip manufacturers, is getting into the laptop market and will have a mobile version of its high-end graphics technology on the market soon, with the ability to support either 32 or 64MB of video RAM. This development-the simultaneous advent of real 3D graphics and the return of real competition to laptop graphics-bodes well for the future of laptop performance.

Along with the changes in graphics technology, the LCD displays found on high-end laptops are getting bigger, with all three of the units tested here supporting either 1,400x1,050 or 1,600x1,200 displays with a viewable image of about 15 inches. This is great for CAD users, but increases the demands on the graphics system and makes less video memory available for 3D acceleration than with smaller screens-and in most cases the vendors have not increased the video memory to compensate for this. In fact, to get decent 3D performance out of the Compaq and IBM units, I had to reduce the color depth to 16-bit color for all three units. All three were also configured for a resolution of 1,280x1,024, in keeping with the resolution at which our previous benchmark tests have been run, and with the requirements of the SolidWorks 99 benchmark.

One thing common to all three units that surprised me was the lack of true dual-head support. The feature was disabled in all three laptops, even though the ATI graphics chips used in all three support this feature. Of course, with the limited graphics memory available on two of the units, running in dual-head mode would use up most or all of the video memory needed for 3D acceleration.

Design Features
In some ways the design of these laptops is improved over previous generations, but in other ways not enough progress has been made in their usability and capabilities. All three units feature infrared ports, and with Windows 2000 now including standard support for transferring files via infrared, this long-awaited feature finally works as it was intended-mostly.
Each manufacturer continues to feature its own proprietary method for supporting interchangeable drives, instead of using an open standard such as Device Bay, limiting the variety of peripherals available for each make and model of laptop. On the bright side, each of these laptops supports the ability to add or remove internal drives without completely shutting down Windows and turning the power off-although doing so requires the unit to enter sleep mode before the change is made in the IBM laptop. Also for the first time, all the laptops I tested could be removed from their docking stations without shutting down Windows. The Compaq and IBM units could be hot-docked and undocked without any interruption, while the Dell needed to be put into suspend mode before being undocked (though it could be docked while running normally).

When it comes to connectivity, all three feature built-in Ethernet and modem ports, although only the IBM's docking station duplicates both (the Compaq's dock relies on a PCI Ethernet card for its network connection and the Dell's dock has only the Ethernet port). None of the ports on these three laptops follow the Intel/Microsoft PC Design Guide for color coding. (The Compaq and Dell docks do have the correct color coding, however.)

Performance Testing
I asked the vendors for laptops with at least 384MB of RAM (a requirement for the SolidWorks benchmark) and preferably 512MB. The Dell and IBM units arrived with 512MB, while the Compaq came with 384MB. I attempted to run our usual suite of benchmarks on all three laptops but ran into problems with two of the applications-the Lightscape viewer and 3D Studio MAX-and so dropped these tests in the end. The Lightscape viewer froze up on two of the three units, and, although 3D Studio ran just fine on all of the units, the benchmark script would not work reliably, preventing me from recording accurate scores. (With the Lightscape viewer, the problem may be simply that it doesn't work well with Windows 2000, or it could also be because of a graphics-driver bug. With the 3D Studio test, the problem is specific to Discreet's test script and not to 3D Studio itself, which ran with no problems.) The remaining tests, which include our 2D and 3D AutoCAD tests, and the SolidWorks 99 benchmark, ran flawlessly and showed off the differences between the three units, as shown in Table 1. Note that all scores shown were achieved at a resolution of 1,280x1,024 with a 16-bit color depth. Running the 3D benchmarks with a true-color setting resulted in slight reductions in the Dell's scores and massive reductions in the scores of the other two. With the exception of the 2D AutoCAD benchmark, Dell's Inspiron 8000 was the fastest in the remaining tests.
Conclusion
These laptops, especially the Dell and IBM, represent some notable but incremental improvements to high-performance laptops. There is still lots of room for improvements to their design, but the advent of Windows 2000 has provided a good platform to support better performance and ease-of-use with future hardware designs. The most exciting improvement evident here, though, is 3D performance. Given the upcoming mobile solutions from NVIDIA, I predict the next round of laptops we test will offer the same level of performance (or better) as Dell's Inspirion 8000. But if you're looking to buy today and 3D performance isn't important, any of these great mobile solutions will do nicely.

 

Inviato Wed 30 Nov 05 @ 2:41 pm
acw_djPRO InfinitySenior staffMember since 2005
Spider911,

A long post you have wrote with alot on info.


Anewsome,

I'm sure there is something wrong with your laptop. Personally I don't like DELL but some of their models are very good. I think you bought a nice one.

N-Vidia 6800 is slower than 6600GT. But it's a nice video card too. This cards have a better performance when are use it in hardware accelarated mode. Also, use Reactivity in MEDIUM to see if this could get you better overall performance when playing videos.

Your laptop is a Pentium 4 or is an AMD64? if is a Pentium 4 chack the bios and turn on the Hyperthreading in the processor. Check if your memory is DDR2 and if the current motherboard chipset is D915.

For sure we can speed up this laptop

 

Inviato Wed 30 Nov 05 @ 6:37 pm
I learned this the hard way.... Go to Nvidia's website & download the latest driver, I believe it's 8195(32 bit), then do all the recommended tweaks, it'll work.
Henry
 

Inviato Wed 30 Nov 05 @ 8:43 pm
Thanks for all the information and tips guys. I will not be using this new laptop for video at all. Like I said, I will be purchasing Pioneer players once I have a resident gig. I've decided not to offer video mixing as a mobile DJ. My mobile sets will remain music only, unless I find a venue that's willing to pay enough to make carrying the extra equipment worth it. I'm not buying a 4th computer trying to chase video with VDJ. It's simply a pain in the ass.
 

Inviato Wed 30 Nov 05 @ 11:08 pm
bagpussPRO InfinityMember since 2003
Does anyone here run video on a laptop successfuly?.

Successfuly = large DVD quality files and able to do a 2 hour show on a plasma or LCD projector screen without problems?.
 

Inviato Thu 01 Dec 05 @ 1:18 am
cyberiaPRO InfinityMember since 2004
I want to reopen this topic because I just started doing the videos on my brand new HP laptop, and I want to make sure I can get the mileage out of it that I want before the 30-day period for returned purchases expires ;). The end goal is to mix videos and look professional doing that, but I decided to first try the $1000 less expensive option than an Alienware box.

So, here it goes.

1. What exactly isn't working for you guys on the laptops that you have? I have an ATI Radeon video card (128 MB), 1 GB of RAM, and the only real problem so far that I noticed is a slight "hiccup" when the video slider first moves from one video to the next. It's barely noticeable to people in the audience, and the music continues to play without interruption. Is this what you're referring to when you say "videos are not working on laptops"? It also seems that this may not be an issue with a skin specifically designed for video mixing (not the default).

2. There WAS an issue for me when the video/music would skip when I loaded a new video on another deck. I was able to work around that by setting Auto BPM to 'Smart' or 'None.' No skips now ;)! Should this be considered a problem due to my hardware?

3. I was able to play VOB files (200MB each), MPEG-1 and MPEG-2. VOB gave me the best quality, and the issues (1&2 above) were the same between the different formats. But, I had to use SmartDVD Ripper on another machine because my new laptop would give me an error when I hit 'Start Ripping'. Anyone knows how I can make the SmartRipper work?

So, should I take this puppy back and put my money somewhere else (Alienware, for example?)

Any thoughts are appreciated. Happy New Year!!!

BTW, controlling videos with TCVs--priceless and simply astounds the audience! Love it!
 

Inviato Sat 31 Dec 05 @ 9:42 pm
mp3jrickPRO InfinityHonorary MemberMember since 2003
I don't get it....

I used to struggle with this Sony Viao P4/2.4g doing audio and searches with the older versions.

With an additional 512 (1g) total, I now mix mpeg1 while searching and changing directories without a hang. It has a Mobility Radeon 7500 video card before you ask.
All of this since 3.2 came out, so program now has some headroom on this machine.
I would start out with an OEM XP Pro version if building a system/LT like that.

Paul Hue is the only one I know that has successfully done vob playback with a laptop.
 

Inviato Sat 31 Dec 05 @ 11:57 pm
Hey Rick, I didn't know U owned a laptop [:o) LOL... thought once you went (rack) there was no looking (back)... hehehe

Anyway, as you suggest to all the laptop users... you really must pay attention to the OS when you decide to use a laptop, or any machine for that matter with vDJ.

If you are serious about it, you should wipe your HDD and install XP Pro with MINIMUM options. That means none of the flashy dashy accessory components like themes and turn off every service that is not applicable. It is better to have an OS that focuses on what you really want the machine for and that is to play with vDJ.

So start with a "clean slate" and go from there. With the new options in video hardware available with laptop purchases now, I think it is perfectly fine to acheive acceptable video mixing performance for pro environments. Have a look at the ZD8000 HP offerings.
 

Inviato Sun 01 Jan 06 @ 7:48 pm
mp3jrickPRO InfinityHonorary MemberMember since 2003
Hey Mele....
This is my back up semi retired unit, its in my blog if you want a peek.

Tell you what though, winter gigs suck with large rack units, I almost dropped it two weeks ago while on wet ice during a load up.
Picked up 17 pounds with this new DJM 3000 mixer, not happy about that, but I love this mixer.

BTW, I bought an OEM XP Pro version for this laptop, but have yet to install it.
Found it for $113.00 on line which was a deal imo.
 

Inviato Sun 01 Jan 06 @ 8:01 pm
hehe @Rick, you keep adding them hardware goodies and you're gonna be right back to back-breaking work.... [:o)

I like to travel light... in fact I wish I could find a nice looking Odyssey Krom-like aluminum case for my handy dandy gig laptop and a few accessories. Anyways thats a different topic.

Good deal on the XP Pro ! As I mentioned, I think thats a good place to start for any laptop DJ... a good clean slate for the OS then go from there. I'm not sure I understood why our friend in an earlier post bought so many laptops in search of one that works for video. I would have been a little more patient in isolating the problem... but I guess if you have $$ like that, then rock on.
 

Inviato Mon 02 Jan 06 @ 4:51 am
Hi, just wanted to report that for new year's eve I've DJed a special 1-hour video set succesfully, using only a laptop and MKII. here are the details:

location: duseldorf, germany
crowd: 200+ people
computer: packard bell laptop, 2,0 GHz centrino, 1024 RAM, nvidia 6200 card, internal hard drive
video files: custom-made 720x576 .avi, 192kbps (average 30mb per file)
projection: 2 projection screens, connected one another

pictures can be seed in my blog:

http://spaces.msn.com/members/rogeriogrilo/PersonalSpace.aspx?_c11_PhotoAlbum_spaHandler=TWljcm9zb2Z0LlNwYWNlcy5XZWIuUGFydHMuUGhvdG9BbGJ1bS5GdWxsTW9kZUNvbnRyb2xsZXI%24&_c11_PhotoAlbum_spaFolderID=cns!1pAkIdrr8kanoiVAp1u3w24g!281&_c=PhotoAlbum

 

Inviato Wed 04 Jan 06 @ 1:22 pm


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