hallabackkid101
How's it going everyone? I'm needing help setting up a home studio. I have a good amount of stuff now, but the recordings to me sound to basic. I'm currently using Ableton Live 9, with Isotope Ozone, and Waves. I have two Condenser mics. MXL 910 (Medium Diaphragm) and a APEX 420 (Large Diaphragm). For my recording interface I am using a Lexicon Lamba. What more would I need to get it to sound better?
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 10:51 am
groovindj
Assuming you're making tracks from scratch, what you need to make it sound better is production and musicianship skills.
You can't just buy something to make your tracks go from basic to professional. It's you that makes that difference. :-)
Where are your sounds coming from? Are you using pre-packaged loops, synth plugins, real instruments?
What are you using for monitor speakers?
You can't just buy something to make your tracks go from basic to professional. It's you that makes that difference. :-)
Where are your sounds coming from? Are you using pre-packaged loops, synth plugins, real instruments?
What are you using for monitor speakers?
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 11:02 am
Tear Em 'Up
I would look into a compressor/limiter. Some sound boards/mixers come with them included. Or, it can be added using Adobe Audition.
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 11:39 am
hallabackkid101
Hey Groove, Thanks for replying. For my monitor speakers I have two Kustom active speakers. They are PA50's. I've developed a few particular skills as far as positioning microphones etc, but as far as compressors etc go, I have no idea. Ableton/waves/Isotope provide compressors via software but that couldn't take te place of the hardware could it?
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 11:40 am
hallabackkid101
Actually those 3 programs provide full mastering functions (limiters, eqs, reverbs, compressors, and all that other good stuff)
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 11:41 am
Tear Em 'Up
Yes, if done properly. Dazmax turned me onto the concept. As with all things, it's all in how it's used.
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 11:43 am
hallabackkid101
groovindj wrote :
Assuming you're making tracks from scratch, what you need to make it sound better is production and musicianship skills.
You can't just buy something to make your tracks go from basic to professional. It's you that makes that difference. :-)
Where are your sounds coming from? Are you using pre-packaged loops, synth plugins, real instruments?
What are you using for monitor speakers?
You can't just buy something to make your tracks go from basic to professional. It's you that makes that difference. :-)
Where are your sounds coming from? Are you using pre-packaged loops, synth plugins, real instruments?
What are you using for monitor speakers?
Yes I am a singer song writer. I use my acoustic guitar and it doesn't have a pick up. The guitar is made by Martin. And the synth, loop things, I have no idea what they are. Keep in mind I'm very new to recording, this is what I want to go to school for after high school. I've DJed since I was 13 ( I'm 17 now). I'm just trying to get a head start in my future.
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 11:44 am
hallabackkid101
TearEmUp wrote :
Yes, if done properly. Dazmax turned me onto the concept. As with all things, it's all in how it's used.
Thanks for the info. I've messed with them a lot trying to get the sound how I like it, and my vocals sound great, I'm having the biggest issue with the guitar.
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 11:46 am
groovindj
Kustom PA50? [goes online to look]......... ah, not exactly studio monitor standard!
If you're producting your own stuff then you really need to be using something designed for letting you hear the small nuances in the music - the difference between one compressor setting and another, or that annoying frequency that you can barely hear.
The idea is to have speakers that don't color the sound. They let you hear it raw, so that if your production sounds good on them, it'll sound good on anything. To be honest, the more different speakers (and places) you use to check your production, the better - but the starting point should be a pair of good "studio monitors", not cheap PA speakers.
Go through the built in lessons in Ableton Live, under the help section. They'll teach you the basics.
If you're producting your own stuff then you really need to be using something designed for letting you hear the small nuances in the music - the difference between one compressor setting and another, or that annoying frequency that you can barely hear.
The idea is to have speakers that don't color the sound. They let you hear it raw, so that if your production sounds good on them, it'll sound good on anything. To be honest, the more different speakers (and places) you use to check your production, the better - but the starting point should be a pair of good "studio monitors", not cheap PA speakers.
Go through the built in lessons in Ableton Live, under the help section. They'll teach you the basics.
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 11:51 am
hallabackkid101
Thank you Groovin, could you please point me in the direction of some decent monitors that aren't to pricey?
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 12:02 pm
groovindj
Anything from the KRK Rokit range would be a good starting point, or the Alesis M1 mk2.
You should consider the speakers to be the most important part of your equipment. That's what allows you to hear what you're doing accurately. Don't skimp on them. If necessary, use the "bank of mum and dad" because if you get something worthwhile now, you won't have to pay out again for an upgrade when you realise what you've been missing.
You should consider the speakers to be the most important part of your equipment. That's what allows you to hear what you're doing accurately. Don't skimp on them. If necessary, use the "bank of mum and dad" because if you get something worthwhile now, you won't have to pay out again for an upgrade when you realise what you've been missing.
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 12:15 pm
Dazmax
The compressor plugins that are available these days are as close as you will get ot the real thing. Better than cheap hardware units and almost as good as high end hardware units + there are loads of them available.
There are a few realy good books out on the market which can seriously help explain many of the tecnical terms and methods used throuh the recording proccess. For example Mixing Audio, Roey Izhaki and Recording Music On Location, Bruce & Jenny Bartlett. Both avalable through Focal Press. Well worth a read :-D
As far as monitors go. The most important thing here is that they translate well. By that I mean that they add as little of there own character to the sound as possible and do not make recordings sound radicaly different to the way they sound when played on standard audio equipment. Easyer said than done. My faves are the good old Yamaha NS10 ( Getting hard to find now) and the units I currently use JBL LSR2300, file under nice but pricey ;-). There are a good few mid priced monitors that fit the bill. Grovin has mentioned the KRK Rokit range which perform very well indeed given the price :-D Shop arround and take some time to listen tho.
Daz
There are a few realy good books out on the market which can seriously help explain many of the tecnical terms and methods used throuh the recording proccess. For example Mixing Audio, Roey Izhaki and Recording Music On Location, Bruce & Jenny Bartlett. Both avalable through Focal Press. Well worth a read :-D
As far as monitors go. The most important thing here is that they translate well. By that I mean that they add as little of there own character to the sound as possible and do not make recordings sound radicaly different to the way they sound when played on standard audio equipment. Easyer said than done. My faves are the good old Yamaha NS10 ( Getting hard to find now) and the units I currently use JBL LSR2300, file under nice but pricey ;-). There are a good few mid priced monitors that fit the bill. Grovin has mentioned the KRK Rokit range which perform very well indeed given the price :-D Shop arround and take some time to listen tho.
Daz
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 12:33 pm
Dazmax
Doing this in two posts so I don't get logged out lol ;-)
Couple of tips for you. Less is more!!! At each stage of the proccess try to get as close to the sound you want befor adding in the next layer. So, Guitar for example. Start with the desk eq flat set your input gain and position the mic. Mess around with the mic position to get the best sound you can without adding any other effect on top. Re set the input gain once this is done. Then use small!! amounts of eq ( If you find you are using more than 3 or 4 db boost or cut on the eq, go back and re position the mic untill you get it sounding right. Once you have a good basic sound then you can add in small amounts of signal processing (compression/gating/expansion) and finish up with any effects you want to add. Don't be tempted to use it cos you got it. Often the way to a nice clean recording is to use as little as you can.
Graphic eq can be usefull once you are mixing tracks together. You can make cuts in frequencey bands where two instruments have to fit in the same frequencey range. (Example Kick Drum and bass guitar) you can drop say the 120hz on the Kick Drum a little to make room for a small boost at 120Hz on the Bass guitar or vice versa. Both instruments can then occupy their place in the mix without masking each other.
The tricks list is as long as it is complex but don't be affraid to just mess around :-) If there is a specific issue that you come up against feel free to PM me and I will do my best to help :-D
Happy mixing
Daz
Couple of tips for you. Less is more!!! At each stage of the proccess try to get as close to the sound you want befor adding in the next layer. So, Guitar for example. Start with the desk eq flat set your input gain and position the mic. Mess around with the mic position to get the best sound you can without adding any other effect on top. Re set the input gain once this is done. Then use small!! amounts of eq ( If you find you are using more than 3 or 4 db boost or cut on the eq, go back and re position the mic untill you get it sounding right. Once you have a good basic sound then you can add in small amounts of signal processing (compression/gating/expansion) and finish up with any effects you want to add. Don't be tempted to use it cos you got it. Often the way to a nice clean recording is to use as little as you can.
Graphic eq can be usefull once you are mixing tracks together. You can make cuts in frequencey bands where two instruments have to fit in the same frequencey range. (Example Kick Drum and bass guitar) you can drop say the 120hz on the Kick Drum a little to make room for a small boost at 120Hz on the Bass guitar or vice versa. Both instruments can then occupy their place in the mix without masking each other.
The tricks list is as long as it is complex but don't be affraid to just mess around :-) If there is a specific issue that you come up against feel free to PM me and I will do my best to help :-D
Happy mixing
Daz
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 12:53 pm
hallabackkid101
Thank you all for the information. I'm going to re-arrange my room today and try to find another position for my mics, etc. Unfortunately I have to use a bedroom to do my recording in. Any thoughts of how I could maybe get a better overall recording from my room? I heard that with it having carpet, it helps a little, that wood makes the sound waves bounce off more. What your thoughts on that?
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 2:36 pm
Dazmax
Good call :-D
To try to avoid lots of room generated reverb. Carpet,heavy drapes/curtains hung on the walls and local damping with tiles is def a good idea. Acoustic tiles come in all kinds of types but a neat trick is to go to your local sports store and get hold of some heavy duty foam rubber exercise matting. It works a treat.
Corners tho,,,,,not so much. I understand the point but unless the walls are lead lined ;-) a corner setting will have an acoustic effect. Its a little like recording in the mouth of a PA horn. The results can be Overblown bass and with say an open or semi open backed guitar amp you can end up with too much of the amps rear radiation being reflected back at you. All kinds of phase cancelations can result. Acoustic damping works well but tends to be frequencey dependant. The lower the frequencey you need to damp, the heavier and more dense the damping material needs to be. The Lead comment was mentioned toung in cheak but it is actualy used in recording studios as an acoustic treatment. It is so dense and heavy that it stops most sound waves dead in their tracks lol. very expensive tho ;-).
If you can post a little more info on some of the sound sources you are using, whate type of guitar, amp and so on it would be usefull. The condenser mics you are using are a good start as they will give a wide and generaly flat frequencey response. Mic positioning on guitar amps for example has a radical effect. eg close, distant and when close micing, where on the amps loudspeaker you place the mic. For example a mic placed close up and centered on the speaker will tend to give a bright edgy sound while a mice placed closer to the edge/surround of the speaker will tend to give a more rounded/smooth sound. You can also mess with having two mics on the amp. One close and one about a meter away. Practice with blending the two sounds for the perfect recording. You can even use a third track with a direct line out from the amp to give you another sound to blend. There are no hard rules here but the general methods are used almost universaly.
Daz
To try to avoid lots of room generated reverb. Carpet,heavy drapes/curtains hung on the walls and local damping with tiles is def a good idea. Acoustic tiles come in all kinds of types but a neat trick is to go to your local sports store and get hold of some heavy duty foam rubber exercise matting. It works a treat.
Corners tho,,,,,not so much. I understand the point but unless the walls are lead lined ;-) a corner setting will have an acoustic effect. Its a little like recording in the mouth of a PA horn. The results can be Overblown bass and with say an open or semi open backed guitar amp you can end up with too much of the amps rear radiation being reflected back at you. All kinds of phase cancelations can result. Acoustic damping works well but tends to be frequencey dependant. The lower the frequencey you need to damp, the heavier and more dense the damping material needs to be. The Lead comment was mentioned toung in cheak but it is actualy used in recording studios as an acoustic treatment. It is so dense and heavy that it stops most sound waves dead in their tracks lol. very expensive tho ;-).
If you can post a little more info on some of the sound sources you are using, whate type of guitar, amp and so on it would be usefull. The condenser mics you are using are a good start as they will give a wide and generaly flat frequencey response. Mic positioning on guitar amps for example has a radical effect. eg close, distant and when close micing, where on the amps loudspeaker you place the mic. For example a mic placed close up and centered on the speaker will tend to give a bright edgy sound while a mice placed closer to the edge/surround of the speaker will tend to give a more rounded/smooth sound. You can also mess with having two mics on the amp. One close and one about a meter away. Practice with blending the two sounds for the perfect recording. You can even use a third track with a direct line out from the amp to give you another sound to blend. There are no hard rules here but the general methods are used almost universaly.
Daz
Inviato Wed 04 Sep 13 @ 9:53 pm
hallabackkid101
I'm currently not using a guitar amp. I have a acoustic guitar with no pick up. It is a Blueridge Br 160. So are you saying position my condenser mic in the middle of my room instead of against a wall? I bought some wind filters today (I know there not as great as pop filters), Just to have until I get my pop filter. Would it help if I posted a picture of my room? I also have a bar that has hard wood floor. The ceiling has ceiling tiles. Would this put an affect on the sound?
Guitar Link - http://www.amazon.com/Blueridge-BR-160-Historic-Dreadnaught-Guitar/dp/B001NLHOCC
Guitar Link - http://www.amazon.com/Blueridge-BR-160-Historic-Dreadnaught-Guitar/dp/B001NLHOCC
Inviato Thu 05 Sep 13 @ 11:09 am
groovindj
What does your room sound like now? If you stand in the middle and clap your hands, do you hear an echo or reverb?
It should ideally be as dead as possible, because it's best to record things (voice, guitar etc.) dry, then add the ambience later with effects such as chorus, reverb, delay etc. If the effect is there on the original (because of the room) you can't take it off.
A bedroom should be fairly dead because of all the soft furnishings.
If you're playing your guitar facing a wall (with the mic in between) then the sound from the guitar will be mixed with reflected sound from the wall. The mic will be picking up direct sound from the front and reflected/delayed sound from the wall.
There is a reason why you see mics set up like this:
It should ideally be as dead as possible, because it's best to record things (voice, guitar etc.) dry, then add the ambience later with effects such as chorus, reverb, delay etc. If the effect is there on the original (because of the room) you can't take it off.
A bedroom should be fairly dead because of all the soft furnishings.
If you're playing your guitar facing a wall (with the mic in between) then the sound from the guitar will be mixed with reflected sound from the wall. The mic will be picking up direct sound from the front and reflected/delayed sound from the wall.
There is a reason why you see mics set up like this:
Inviato Thu 05 Sep 13 @ 11:40 am
hallabackkid101
My room has ceiling tiles and provides no echo/reverb in the making of the recording. What exactly does that back mat panel thing do?
Inviato Thu 05 Sep 13 @ 4:09 pm
groovindj
Come on, you should be able to work it out from what I said in the post...
Inviato Thu 05 Sep 13 @ 4:12 pm
hallabackkid101
Ahhh I got you. I didn't know that's what you were referring too. My bad Groove. Thanks for everyone's help!
Inviato Thu 05 Sep 13 @ 4:46 pm
