ConQuest
So last night me and my partners and friends (Icy Ice and Curse - Beat Junkies, 93.5 KDAY, VisuALL, Legend Ent. - and special guest Jymnastyc - Unique Technique, VisuALL, XFactoR) did our monthly b-day celebrant gig and I switched my mixing style around and avoided using music videos for every song. Instead I started mixing 2-3 music videos back to back followed by 2-3 songs without video.
We felt that this was much better overall. This allows the crowd to stay focused on the music at all times and not get too distracted with the music videos, turning the event into a viewing room.
I've heard other friends of mine tell me that they had experienced this at clubs that had videos, in particular a club in Las Vegas. Someone told me that they had been spinning there and when the VDJ came on, the crowd seemed to fixate on the videos and the dance crowd energy diminished.
Taking that useful information into account, I tried this last night and we felt that the vibe was much better because it kind of gives the videos a "wow" factor all over again when they come back on.
Also, I was concerned with the fact that I was starting to let the quality of my music selection go down because I was focusing on which video I was going to play as opposed to which song would be better at the moment to hype the crowd up.
Anyways, I just thought I'd share that and see if anyone has experienced any of the above.
- VT ConQuest
(Visual Turntablist - VisuALL, XFactoR, Legend Entertainment)
We felt that this was much better overall. This allows the crowd to stay focused on the music at all times and not get too distracted with the music videos, turning the event into a viewing room.
I've heard other friends of mine tell me that they had experienced this at clubs that had videos, in particular a club in Las Vegas. Someone told me that they had been spinning there and when the VDJ came on, the crowd seemed to fixate on the videos and the dance crowd energy diminished.
Taking that useful information into account, I tried this last night and we felt that the vibe was much better because it kind of gives the videos a "wow" factor all over again when they come back on.
Also, I was concerned with the fact that I was starting to let the quality of my music selection go down because I was focusing on which video I was going to play as opposed to which song would be better at the moment to hype the crowd up.
Anyways, I just thought I'd share that and see if anyone has experienced any of the above.
- VT ConQuest
(Visual Turntablist - VisuALL, XFactoR, Legend Entertainment)
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 2:35 am
cstoll
I have found what you describe is true for places that don't do video 100% every night. Since VDJ was able to videos, we have run videos in our club - Every Night! - and what we have experienced is the WOW! factor for only those who come to the club for the first time. Those that have been there before know that that is our format so they expect it and it's no longer a distraction. Matter of fact, the reverse is now true - if I don't have the video, they are discouraged, but still want to hear their song.
I believe that your scenario and mine is the norm in this new age of being able to do the video more readily and with the versatility in the control now available verses the old VHS days, if you got it - you got it and they enjoy it. If you tease them, then they get awed and stand around.
So, to break the awed response you need to fill the gap with what makes them come out - that's the music and the vibe created.
And, btw; I don't think about the video anymore - there are alot of great tracks with awful videos and where I used to avoid them I now play them - because of the track.
cstoll
I believe that your scenario and mine is the norm in this new age of being able to do the video more readily and with the versatility in the control now available verses the old VHS days, if you got it - you got it and they enjoy it. If you tease them, then they get awed and stand around.
So, to break the awed response you need to fill the gap with what makes them come out - that's the music and the vibe created.
And, btw; I don't think about the video anymore - there are alot of great tracks with awful videos and where I used to avoid them I now play them - because of the track.
cstoll
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 2:55 am
ConQuest
cstoll wrote :
So, to break the awed response you need to fill the gap with what makes them come out - that's the music and the vibe created.
Agreed. =)
That was the point I was making so that others can avoid it.
Focus on the music and the vibe first, and once that is as good as it can be, then supplement that with the videos and/or visuals.
I had simply caught myself focusing on which video I was going to play next instead of which song would be better to keep the crowd hype or make them hyper.
Music first!
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 3:11 am
low-fat-al
Any way you look at it.. you should ALWAYS focus on the music programming. It is basically a bonus if you happen to have the video as well. I program according to what is needed. I then figure out on the fly what visually I can do to make it more appealing.
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 4:01 am
ConQuest
low-fat-al wrote :
you should ALWAYS focus on the music programming. It is basically a bonus if you happen to have the video as well.
Exactly.
I almost found myself getting too caught up in the video aspect and prioritizing it over the music.
I just posted this observation so that others may avoid this from the start. =)
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 4:37 am
ktilak
I recently joined a DJ crew.... I'm the only one with video capabilities. (and i JUST got into video)
Obviously, when we do club events together, they'll look for me to do video and only video, then i'll pass it back to them for the audio-only breaks.
When they're doing audio-only i'll be putting up bar specials, visualizations, company banners, etc..
Any suggestions for a guy who's pretty much forced to spin his limited music-video collection?
Obviously, when we do club events together, they'll look for me to do video and only video, then i'll pass it back to them for the audio-only breaks.
When they're doing audio-only i'll be putting up bar specials, visualizations, company banners, etc..
Any suggestions for a guy who's pretty much forced to spin his limited music-video collection?
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 8:47 am
bagpuss
This is why I believe the ultimate solution is to have a DJ and a VJ in the booth, and occasionaly the VJ can take the requests for the DJ, whilst the DJ can play a few music videos here and there. I've personally found that certain videos enhance the effectivenes of the song, whilst others bring the song down. I've also found that some people find it difficult to dance when there is a huge screen beside them with professional dancers going at it..
Ultimately I find that 99% of the people in the club are listening to the music, whilst only 1% are looking at the screens, the visual interest in clubs is already very busy, there are lots of people and other attractions such as the lighting show, it's mainly a social atmosphere, so eye contact is more frequent than not, dancers don't dance to screens, they are looking around, many seem to have their eyes closed as if they are loving the music that much.
These are my observations.
Ultimately I find that 99% of the people in the club are listening to the music, whilst only 1% are looking at the screens, the visual interest in clubs is already very busy, there are lots of people and other attractions such as the lighting show, it's mainly a social atmosphere, so eye contact is more frequent than not, dancers don't dance to screens, they are looking around, many seem to have their eyes closed as if they are loving the music that much.
These are my observations.
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 8:25 pm
Rune (DJ-In-Norway)
I too think that the future will have more creative video use than the mtv a to b mixing style.
Videos like MTV broadcast is hot enough today, but in the near future, djs adding visual effects, video overlays and clips, will gain more interest. Making a show apart from regular music tv ...
But sayin that 1% care about video, and 99% only about audio, is not true ;)
The VISUAL element of the club is a VERY important part, that be great lightshows, cool interiour design, flashy bar, smoke, monitors, and now videos... Videos will be normal in clubs soon enough, do doubt.
As for being difficult to dance with dance videos on monitors, and videos with pro dancers being a turn off, well clubs have hired dancers since the 80s to dance on all from floor to speakers and elevated areas, or mirrors to make a reflection of dancefloor... . Because it does the oposite, makes people dance... And so will a sexy house video do ;) its just a visual element.. That most find cool. They like MTV too you know;)
The fear for video is usually not based on observations, but rather own negative reflections about it..
Its perfectly allowed not to like videos, but it will be a huge part of djing ... real soon;) No doubt..
But it will evolve, and probably have more of visual elements, than TV-style A to B video mix .
And a video/visual show will be a damn cool element added to the clubs;)
Those who have it, will attract people... and other clubs will see that, and follow.. ;)
Videos like MTV broadcast is hot enough today, but in the near future, djs adding visual effects, video overlays and clips, will gain more interest. Making a show apart from regular music tv ...
But sayin that 1% care about video, and 99% only about audio, is not true ;)
The VISUAL element of the club is a VERY important part, that be great lightshows, cool interiour design, flashy bar, smoke, monitors, and now videos... Videos will be normal in clubs soon enough, do doubt.
As for being difficult to dance with dance videos on monitors, and videos with pro dancers being a turn off, well clubs have hired dancers since the 80s to dance on all from floor to speakers and elevated areas, or mirrors to make a reflection of dancefloor... . Because it does the oposite, makes people dance... And so will a sexy house video do ;) its just a visual element.. That most find cool. They like MTV too you know;)
The fear for video is usually not based on observations, but rather own negative reflections about it..
Its perfectly allowed not to like videos, but it will be a huge part of djing ... real soon;) No doubt..
But it will evolve, and probably have more of visual elements, than TV-style A to B video mix .
And a video/visual show will be a damn cool element added to the clubs;)
Those who have it, will attract people... and other clubs will see that, and follow.. ;)
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 9:30 pm
bagpuss
1% was a little generous of me.., when I play at the club to well over 2000 people I never catch anyone looking at the screens, but to say that all clubs will utilise screens as a means to show "Music Videos" is also incorrect. The present isn't waiting for the future to happen, the present is well established and very profitable, I feel no sense of waiting as you do perhaps.
I consider most music videos to be untasty and a turn off, I can name thousands of great songs, just not that many great music videos.
VJ'ing has been going on for years and will continue to do so, the software and hardware for VJs will continue to evolve and make more possible on the fly, just as it has with the DJ industry, the idea of this artform is to be a bit individual in the process of it all, MTV is a horrible example in everything that it does, they are simply about money, I see no passion from them, investing in them wont bring about any positive change for me.
I don't believe that the utilisation of screens will take shape in any set style, and who would want it to? I'm personally impressed with the show that our VJ puts on, and so is the management, I hope to see something different when I go to a club on my holidays, I also hope to hear different music, not the kind of music that graces the screens of MTV, perhaps something a bit more cultural or dare I say it 'deep'.
As said before, some venues will opt for a DJ and VJ in one, but I believe the current trend of having a seperate DJ and VJ will also remain very common. You'll also have quite a few Venues that wont have a VJ in any form (as now).
DJ's can't dance..
I consider most music videos to be untasty and a turn off, I can name thousands of great songs, just not that many great music videos.
VJ'ing has been going on for years and will continue to do so, the software and hardware for VJs will continue to evolve and make more possible on the fly, just as it has with the DJ industry, the idea of this artform is to be a bit individual in the process of it all, MTV is a horrible example in everything that it does, they are simply about money, I see no passion from them, investing in them wont bring about any positive change for me.
I don't believe that the utilisation of screens will take shape in any set style, and who would want it to? I'm personally impressed with the show that our VJ puts on, and so is the management, I hope to see something different when I go to a club on my holidays, I also hope to hear different music, not the kind of music that graces the screens of MTV, perhaps something a bit more cultural or dare I say it 'deep'.
As said before, some venues will opt for a DJ and VJ in one, but I believe the current trend of having a seperate DJ and VJ will also remain very common. You'll also have quite a few Venues that wont have a VJ in any form (as now).
DJ's can't dance..
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 10:05 pm
Rune (DJ-In-Norway)
Bagpuss wrote :
I've also found that some people find it difficult to dance when there is a huge screen beside them with professional dancers going at it..
Bagpuss wrote :
.., when I play at the club to well over 2000 people I never catch anyone looking at the screens,
First of all, make up your mind ;) hehe
Do they find it distracting, or do they not look at all.. ;)
It cant be both...
And you kinda sound like the sour djs that where against CDs when they came, and DJ software when that came.. ;) hehe.... But you cant stop progress, and just as DJ software came, video mixing will too...
Bagpuss wrote :
I consider most music videos to be untasty and a turn off
I consider most music videos to be untasty and a turn off
Well, your allowed to think that;) Never the less, people watch MTV and like music videos..
Even the consumer market is starting to change, from regular CD sale, to DVD sale, where the consumer gets musicvideos, and not only audio tracks ;) To be played at MediaCenter or DVD players.
Microsoft gets it (WMC), Pioneer gets it (DVD DJ Decks), VDJ & Numark gets it (software & hardware), and so does the rest of the industry...
so dont live in the past ;) Djs cant dance, but they can play videos.. now;) because the solutions are now affordable, available, and getting common...
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 10:54 pm
Rune (DJ-In-Norway)
Its just a visual element, and many clubs already have the screens there... why not use them for something a bit more interesting than a slide show ;)
And its just an extra visual elements, making the club screens look hot..
And its just an extra visual elements, making the club screens look hot..
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 11:04 pm
DJ Marcel_1
No fair
FERGIE is too damned hot!
FERGIE is too damned hot!
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 11:07 pm
sbangs
i think video is a good pleaser
people may not look up at it all the time but it makes for a good adaptive fx space.
people may not look up at it all the time but it makes for a good adaptive fx space.
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 11:07 pm
bagpuss
People don't really look at the screens, a few glance now and again. period.
From my experience, Music videos do demand more attention then an on-screen lighting show, and find many videos uninspiring or disturbing to the dancefloor. I'm speaking from real life experience as Conquest is, so we are lying because we aren't in accordance with your ideal?
From my experience, Music videos do demand more attention then an on-screen lighting show, and find many videos uninspiring or disturbing to the dancefloor. I'm speaking from real life experience as Conquest is, so we are lying because we aren't in accordance with your ideal?
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 11:51 pm
Rune (DJ-In-Norway)
lol ;) calm down..
Your recent few gigs dont make you a spokeperson for the future of the DJ industry either,..hehe.
Or for clubmanagers
Lets just wait and see.. ;)
Come back to this thread in one year.. I'll buy you a beer if I was wrong;)
Your recent few gigs dont make you a spokeperson for the future of the DJ industry either,..hehe.
Or for clubmanagers
Lets just wait and see.. ;)
Come back to this thread in one year.. I'll buy you a beer if I was wrong;)
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 11:54 pm
sbangs
yes peace and love folks the only way:)
Inviato Mon 19 Mar 07 @ 11:58 pm
ktilak
i'm with you norway... but will you still buy me a beer?
;) lol
;) lol
Inviato Tue 20 Mar 07 @ 12:02 am
djej
i have to get off of 666 messages that i just noticed. I'm kinda with Rune on this one. At least that's my experience thus far as we move into a different world. Media, in whatever form, is hitting people like it never has before. Grocery Line commericals, internet, elevator commercials...unbelieveable. The more visual the better it seems. If only some like it...you just pleased those people...plus the music people because there is still good music when done right. The bigger the show, the more grandeur...is that ever bad? I'll buy the beer in a year from now :)
Inviato Tue 20 Mar 07 @ 12:19 am
Rune (DJ-In-Norway)
Sure will... hehe;)
Inviato Tue 20 Mar 07 @ 12:20 am
bagpuss
Well I've been going to clubs for many years, and been studying the industry for just as many. I'm not claiming to be any sort of authority on the matter, but my experiences and opinions are as valid as anyone elses.
No one here is denying the big trend in screen utilization in the form of music videos, it's particuarly apparent in Pubs and Bars, I find Super Clubs and Annual Music festivals to have a more diverse approach, please stop me if I'm wrong. It is my opinion that this is a good thing, because Music videos aren't for everyone, and there is more music without a video than their is with a music video. Stop me if I'm wrong.
I really can't see what is so controversial about my opinion, that the hype of video mixing is not quite the revolution some would persuade us of, I think VJs aren't going out of business anytime soon.
What I am saying can be condensed into this: Mainstream DJ'ing will not COMPLETELY switch from an Audio format into a Music Video format, some DJ's will, some DJ's wont, both will co-exist although it will cause petty competition. Now to look at the idols of "clubland", The best DJs in the world aren't ALL gifted in the art of VJ'ing, and most of THEIR music isn't designed for MTV, so it doesn't have a music video, therfore it wont be possible to do Music Video gigs. stop me if I'm wrong.
I'm happy to discuess all or any one of my points in detail, and would rather that than a slinging match.
and finally I prefer Red wine or Fruit juice to beer, different drinks for different needs..different themes for different dreams ;).
you can still buy me a beer though.. :).
No one here is denying the big trend in screen utilization in the form of music videos, it's particuarly apparent in Pubs and Bars, I find Super Clubs and Annual Music festivals to have a more diverse approach, please stop me if I'm wrong. It is my opinion that this is a good thing, because Music videos aren't for everyone, and there is more music without a video than their is with a music video. Stop me if I'm wrong.
I really can't see what is so controversial about my opinion, that the hype of video mixing is not quite the revolution some would persuade us of, I think VJs aren't going out of business anytime soon.
What I am saying can be condensed into this: Mainstream DJ'ing will not COMPLETELY switch from an Audio format into a Music Video format, some DJ's will, some DJ's wont, both will co-exist although it will cause petty competition. Now to look at the idols of "clubland", The best DJs in the world aren't ALL gifted in the art of VJ'ing, and most of THEIR music isn't designed for MTV, so it doesn't have a music video, therfore it wont be possible to do Music Video gigs. stop me if I'm wrong.
I'm happy to discuess all or any one of my points in detail, and would rather that than a slinging match.
and finally I prefer Red wine or Fruit juice to beer, different drinks for different needs..different themes for different dreams ;).
you can still buy me a beer though.. :).
Inviato Tue 20 Mar 07 @ 12:38 am
